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  • #31
    Welcome Curious. As a long time participant here I can understand your first reactions to being scrutinised. It's inevitable that some here will choose words suggesting less , err, kindness, than others. This shouldn't worry you, as you come from Texas, right?.
    There are posters here who will do their darndest to flesh out the fine details of what you do and , more importantly, why. That's not a bad thing. I promise, all of those folks have had the veritable tarnish flayed from their coppery skins on numerous occasions and lived to post again. Me included.
    Science needs to be a little tough, those of us who admire the work of leaders in our therapeutic field and may wish to make a contribution themselves will know that the mill grinds out lots of players, but not so many stayers. The longer you stay, the more likely you will either, influence others, or be influenced, or both.
    If you are looking to have your views routinely accepted and not criticised then you are in the wrong forum, as welcome though you certainly are. Your own critical scientific mindfullness may well get stirred and stimulated however if you stay and participate.
    Cheers
    :lightbulb vox clamantis in deserto

    Geoff Fisher
    Physiotherapist

    Comment


    • #32
      Patrick L wrote
      That's the key question I think. What guides our verbalized claims?
      I'm a structuralist/processist, if I can't consistently find the tissue in an anatomy book and a process in a physiology book then i'm moving from being paid for physical therapy to philosophy/entertainment. Science is entertaining enough (just not in a 'CSI: miami' way). I philosophise/entertain when my meters off, when the meters up it's time to drive the known highways and byways of the human body.
      "Whereof one cannot speak, thereof one must be silent." ("Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muss man schweigen.“) Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus Ludwig Wittgenstein
      Question your tea spoons. Georges Perec

      Comment


      • #33
        Welcome Curious.
        This site has been around for a while and many of its members started like you: by being curious about what it has to offer.
        Some of us did not find here what we hoped for: like-minded, laid-back folks who are super-tolerant.
        What they found here was a mixed bunch of professionals who care deeply about the exploration of the therapeutic interaction and all its components; picking apart ideas and models to see which ones had legs to stand on (forgive my mixed metaphores) in order to improve our own views and models of practice.

        The like-mindedness you were hoping for may be different from what you expected.
        I hope that won't deter you from hanging around and soaking up some of the threads.
        The questions you were asked are indeed the trend here: any, any proposed therapy or technique is open for analysis here.
        Has nothing to do with you personally.

        See you around?
        We don't see things as they are, we see things as WE are - Anais Nin

        I suppose it's easier to believe something than it is to understand it.
        Cmdr. Chris Hadfield on rise of poor / pseudo science

        Pain is a conscious correlate of the implicit perception of threat to body tissue - Lorimer Moseley

        We don't need a body to feel a body. Ronald Melzack

        Comment


        • #34
          Curious One,

          Welcome. I look forward to hearing your opinion. Keep in mind this is a science based site with clinicians seeking to find the science behind the assessment and treatment options they use. You stated:

          I am quite eclectic in my private practice and do not have a pressing need to only work in one manner or style. If a particular modality is what helps a patient or client, and I have that skill, I am happy to apply it.
          This site is devoted tp examining why a particular modaility helps a patient. Many here are not just happy that it 'worked' and the patient felt better.

          I really hope you stick around. There is so much to be learned.
          Rob Willcott Physiotherapist

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Walt Fritz View Post
            If there is a need to confirm that Curious is in fact who she says she is, I can attest to knowing her and her real name. Welcome...Curious
            Thanks. Much appreciated.


            Originally posted by TexasOrtho View Post
            You might be over-thinking this a bit Curious. I promise no one here will laugh themselves to sleep tonight about a misspelled word.
            The "oh joy" was my attempt at a joke. Obviously, I failed.
            C.O. ( gender: ) - LMT, BS(Anatomy), DC
            Music Fog... pick a song to listen to... you can't go wrong.
            Need relaxation samples for your office? I have made a Deep Relaxation Massage Music Pandora Station and have others that may also be useful - about 8 massage music stations and about 49 other nifty options.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by Mark Hollis View Post
              The same forces on the same body part on the same person can produce the same result, despite the story locked away in the therapist's brain, but the story will determine further/other contextual features of the treatment because of the therapist's brain.

              I've found the site a good place to discover the 'beCAUSE' although it will sometimes feel like you're having to go through 'deSPITE'.

              Anyhoo, welcome
              Thanks for the welcome.
              C.O. ( gender: ) - LMT, BS(Anatomy), DC
              Music Fog... pick a song to listen to... you can't go wrong.
              Need relaxation samples for your office? I have made a Deep Relaxation Massage Music Pandora Station and have others that may also be useful - about 8 massage music stations and about 49 other nifty options.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by John W View Post
                I think reflexology- along with a lot of other complementary and alternative medical (CAM) treatments- are not only very poorly supported by science and evidence, but I also think they are harmful to patients and society in general because they detract from our professional obligation to move our understanding forward so that we can improve our care of patients.

                I take that duty seriously, which includes asking questions of others who claim to be health care professionals.
                I absolutely agree that many CAM treatments are poorly supported by science. And correct me if I am wrong, but CAM treatments are also not researched in routine like other forms of medicine.

                The money which is put into research is not heavily aimed at CAM treatments, is it?

                I'm glad you take your duty seriously... and I appreciate a place where people can come to flesh out ideas. There is a place for everyone. Some people lean more on the research side of the sciences, some people do more physical work, some people get results and then come back to the researchers with the ideas that get those brilliant minds thinking about even more types of research.



                What is frustrating, is that I actually came here looking to dig around and see what the bright minds of my generation are doing (yes, that would be you), and the first response in the "welcome" thread is some sort of negativity. You probably don't even see it that way. As an admin/moderator/longtime member of a forum, I understand that one needs to be vigilant to see where a problem is going to surface... I get that.

                I'm just thinking that being negative toward someone looking to learn more from you, probably isn't the best way to be an encouragement or to be "welcoming" in the "Welcome Section". Especially toward individuals who are open to putting time and effort into working toward providing more research in the exact fields you don't feel are well represented. Obviously you feel the research is warranted, or you wouldn't suggest that it is "our professional obligation to move our understanding forward so that we can improve our care of patients". :/


                Originally posted by PatrickL View Post
                That's the key question I think. What guides our verbalized claims?
                Great point... and thanks for the welcome.


                Originally posted by ginger View Post
                There are posters here who will do their darndest to flesh out the fine details of what you do and , more importantly, why. That's not a bad thing.

                Science needs to be a little tough, those of us who admire the work of leaders in our therapeutic field and may wish to make a contribution themselves will know that the mill grinds out lots of players, but not so many stayers. The longer you stay, the more likely you will either, influence others, or be influenced, or both.

                If you are looking to have your views routinely accepted and not criticised then you are in the wrong forum, as welcome though you certainly are. Your own critical scientific mindfullness may well get stirred and stimulated however if you stay and participate.
                Cheers
                Thanks for the welcome, and I agree that looking at the fine details is not a bad thing. But, it might be nice to give me some links to any threads you have discussing whatever it is that you already don't like about alternative medicine before just jumping all over the new person, so I can get a better feel for what has already been said. Maybe I agree with much of it, but am not the best at verbalizing.

                There's really no way to know, because it's so comfortable for most folks on the forum to just jump right in and sound like they are badgering someone, even though they don't mean it.

                Hope that makes more sense.
                Last edited by Curious One; 28-08-2012, 05:32 PM.
                C.O. ( gender: ) - LMT, BS(Anatomy), DC
                Music Fog... pick a song to listen to... you can't go wrong.
                Need relaxation samples for your office? I have made a Deep Relaxation Massage Music Pandora Station and have others that may also be useful - about 8 massage music stations and about 49 other nifty options.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Mark Hollis View Post
                  when the meters up it's time to drive the known highways and byways of the human body.
                  You should use this as a "quote".

                  And, isn't that what research is also all about... learning more about the unknowns too? Sort of like Einstein...
                  Last edited by Curious One; 28-08-2012, 05:43 PM.
                  C.O. ( gender: ) - LMT, BS(Anatomy), DC
                  Music Fog... pick a song to listen to... you can't go wrong.
                  Need relaxation samples for your office? I have made a Deep Relaxation Massage Music Pandora Station and have others that may also be useful - about 8 massage music stations and about 49 other nifty options.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Bas Asselbergs View Post
                    What they found here was a mixed bunch of professionals who care deeply about the exploration of the therapeutic interaction and all its components; picking apart ideas and models to see which ones had legs to stand on (forgive my mixed metaphores) in order to improve our own views and models of practice.

                    The like-mindedness you were hoping for may be different from what you expected.
                    I hope that won't deter you from hanging around and soaking up some of the threads.
                    The questions you were asked are indeed the trend here: any, any proposed therapy or technique is open for analysis here.
                    Has nothing to do with you personally.

                    See you around?
                    Thanks for the comment... it is much appreciated.



                    Originally posted by advantage1 View Post
                    I really hope you stick around. There is so much to be learned.
                    Most appreciated. I hope I can.
                    Last edited by Curious One; 28-08-2012, 05:43 PM.
                    C.O. ( gender: ) - LMT, BS(Anatomy), DC
                    Music Fog... pick a song to listen to... you can't go wrong.
                    Need relaxation samples for your office? I have made a Deep Relaxation Massage Music Pandora Station and have others that may also be useful - about 8 massage music stations and about 49 other nifty options.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Oh, and if anyone knows how to do something about the "time out" on the forum, or lead me to a thread where I can read how to make it longer, it would be nice.

                      I keep getting tossed out and when I try to log back in, it sends me into a no-mans zone.

                      Then I have to go to google, search out the forum again and then come back and re-sign in.

                      Thanks in advance.
                      C.O. ( gender: ) - LMT, BS(Anatomy), DC
                      Music Fog... pick a song to listen to... you can't go wrong.
                      Need relaxation samples for your office? I have made a Deep Relaxation Massage Music Pandora Station and have others that may also be useful - about 8 massage music stations and about 49 other nifty options.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Things that aren't plausible to begin with warrant no research.
                        Barrett L. Dorko

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Barrett Dorko View Post
                          Things that aren't plausible to begin with warrant no research.
                          Wow... all CAM treatments, huh? That's very open minded of you.
                          C.O. ( gender: ) - LMT, BS(Anatomy), DC
                          Music Fog... pick a song to listen to... you can't go wrong.
                          Need relaxation samples for your office? I have made a Deep Relaxation Massage Music Pandora Station and have others that may also be useful - about 8 massage music stations and about 49 other nifty options.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            I really don't think you want to imply that I am either closed or open minded.
                            Barrett L. Dorko

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Don't have your mind so open that your brain falls out. Some CAM falls into that category.
                              Last edited by Sheffphysio; 28-08-2012, 06:23 PM.
                              Dave

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Hi Curious and welcome.

                                I too am a massage therapist. Karen lines (another MT) gave some good advice in post #13. Take your time, give yourself time.

                                It'll kind of go like this :

                                :angry:, :cry:, :sad:, , , , and finally

                                :teeth:

                                Happy reading.
                                Carol Lynn Chevrier LMT
                                " The truth is, people may see things differently. But they don't really want to. '' Don Draper.

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