Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

"FATHERS" AND "SONS" OF THEORIES

Collapse
This is a sticky topic.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • "FATHERS" AND "SONS" OF THEORIES

    "Fathers" and "sons" of theories in cell physiology: the membrane theory.
    Cell. Mol. Biol., 51(8): 797-801, 2005



    1Laboratory of Cell Physiology, Institute of Cytology, Russian Academy of Sciences,
    Tikhoretsky Ave 4, St. Petersburg 194064, Russia and

    2BioMedES, Leggat House, Keithhall, Inverurie, Aberdeen AB51 0LX, UK


    Abstract. The last 50 years in the history of life sciences are remarkable for a new important feature that looks as a great threat for their future. Aprofound specialization dominating in quickly developing fields of science causes a crisis of the scientific method. The essence of the method is a unity of two elements, the experimental data and the theory that explains them. To us, "fathers" of science, classically, were the creators of new ideas and theories. They were the true experts of their own theories. It is only they who have the right to say: "I am the theory". In other words, they were carriers of theories, of the theoretical knowledge. The fathers provided the necessary logical integrity to their theories, since theories in biology have still to be based on strict mathematical proofs. It is not true for sons. As a result of massive specialization, modern experts operate in very confined close spaces. They formulate particular rules far from the level of theory. The main theories of science are known to them only at the textbook level. Nowadays, nobody can say: "I am the theory". With whom, then is it possible to discuss today on a broader theoretical level? How can a classical theory - for example, the membrane one - be changed or even disproved under these conditions? How can the "sons" with their narrow education catch sight of membrane theory defects? As a result, "global" theories have few critics and control. Due to specialization, we have lost the ability to work at the experimental level of biology within the correct or appropriate theoretical context. The scientific method in its classic form is now being rapidly eroded. A good case can be made for "Membrane Theory", to which we will largely refer throughout this article.
    Attached Files
    Last edited by bernard; 03-05-2006, 07:29 AM.
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. L VINCI
    We are to admit no more causes of natural things than such as are both true and sufficient to explain their appearances. I NEWTON

    Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not a bit simpler.
    If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. Albert Einstein
    bernard

  • #2
    Loved the article Bernard, glad we're not the only ones (PTs) noticing the problem: Not so sure I'm so pleased to learn that the problem extends far beyond PT.

    I'm planning to read it carefully and see if we can glean anything from it, for us, and in light of the MFR thread.
    Diane
    www.dermoneuromodulation.com
    SensibleSolutionsPhysiotherapy
    HumanAntiGravitySuit blog
    Neurotonics PT Teamblog
    Canadian Physiotherapy Pain Science Division (Archived newsletters, paincasts)
    Canadian Physiotherapy Association Pain Science Division Facebook page
    @PainPhysiosCan
    WCPT PhysiotherapyPainNetwork on Facebook
    @WCPTPTPN
    Neuroscience and Pain Science for Manual PTs Facebook page

    @dfjpt
    SomaSimple on Facebook
    @somasimple

    "Rene Descartes was very very smart, but as it turned out, he was wrong." ~Lorimer Moseley

    “Comment is free, but the facts are sacred.” ~Charles Prestwich Scott, nephew of founder and editor (1872-1929) of The Guardian , in a 1921 Centenary editorial

    “If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you, but if you really make them think, they'll hate you." ~Don Marquis

    "In times of change, learners inherit the earth, while the learned find themselves beautifully equipped to deal with a world that no longer exists" ~Roland Barth

    "Doubt is not a pleasant mental state, but certainty is a ridiculous one."~Voltaire

    Comment


    • #3
      Great stuff, Bernard...one can substitute 'physiotherapy practice' as the 'cell' and not lose the gist of the paper. We love looking at molecules and splitting them, but forget about the cell, and what a bunch of cells actually is in terms of the organism, and then back to where that organism fits (in Darwinian evolutionary sens of fitness) with the environment.


      Nari

      Comment


      • #4
        I read the paper quite thoroughly and found much to consider, much that aligned with thoughts I already have about how things are going, especially in PT these days..

        About cell membranes, I haven't read the AIH theory, or the person putting it forward, Gilbert Ling. I'd like to.

        I was thinking how much autonomy cells give up in order to become parts of cell communities. As single cell creatures, they do everything through that membrane which has to accommodate communication, swapping of DNA, eating, excretion, respiration. They are free to come and go either by being washed around in a current, or by crawling around using their cytoskelton to make streaming pseudopods.

        When they become a member of a community their food gets delivered to them, and their excretion carried away, but they still have to respire, etc through the membrane. They aren't free to move any more unless they are a neutrophile or some other immune cell. They can't just exchange DNA freely, and they have to make extra stuff for other cells. Then when their life is over they are expected to commit apoptosis. I wonder what's in it for them.
        Diane
        www.dermoneuromodulation.com
        SensibleSolutionsPhysiotherapy
        HumanAntiGravitySuit blog
        Neurotonics PT Teamblog
        Canadian Physiotherapy Pain Science Division (Archived newsletters, paincasts)
        Canadian Physiotherapy Association Pain Science Division Facebook page
        @PainPhysiosCan
        WCPT PhysiotherapyPainNetwork on Facebook
        @WCPTPTPN
        Neuroscience and Pain Science for Manual PTs Facebook page

        @dfjpt
        SomaSimple on Facebook
        @somasimple

        "Rene Descartes was very very smart, but as it turned out, he was wrong." ~Lorimer Moseley

        “Comment is free, but the facts are sacred.” ~Charles Prestwich Scott, nephew of founder and editor (1872-1929) of The Guardian , in a 1921 Centenary editorial

        “If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you, but if you really make them think, they'll hate you." ~Don Marquis

        "In times of change, learners inherit the earth, while the learned find themselves beautifully equipped to deal with a world that no longer exists" ~Roland Barth

        "Doubt is not a pleasant mental state, but certainty is a ridiculous one."~Voltaire

        Comment


        • #5
          I forgot to mention that I liked the "Conceptual Hallucinations" idea put out by the author. Sort of like the "perceptual fantasies" we have to sort through and weed out in PT...
          Diane
          www.dermoneuromodulation.com
          SensibleSolutionsPhysiotherapy
          HumanAntiGravitySuit blog
          Neurotonics PT Teamblog
          Canadian Physiotherapy Pain Science Division (Archived newsletters, paincasts)
          Canadian Physiotherapy Association Pain Science Division Facebook page
          @PainPhysiosCan
          WCPT PhysiotherapyPainNetwork on Facebook
          @WCPTPTPN
          Neuroscience and Pain Science for Manual PTs Facebook page

          @dfjpt
          SomaSimple on Facebook
          @somasimple

          "Rene Descartes was very very smart, but as it turned out, he was wrong." ~Lorimer Moseley

          “Comment is free, but the facts are sacred.” ~Charles Prestwich Scott, nephew of founder and editor (1872-1929) of The Guardian , in a 1921 Centenary editorial

          “If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you, but if you really make them think, they'll hate you." ~Don Marquis

          "In times of change, learners inherit the earth, while the learned find themselves beautifully equipped to deal with a world that no longer exists" ~Roland Barth

          "Doubt is not a pleasant mental state, but certainty is a ridiculous one."~Voltaire

          Comment


          • #6
            Diane,
            the book by Ling is freely available => (Not sure it works on Mac)
            http://www.advancedphysics.org/forum...ead.php?t=2149

            I'm just amazed that a theory with such mysteries and incoherences is still the well accepted.

            Just take this one;

            Original experiments about action potentials were made with giant squid axons. Axons but not neurons, just parts of neurons. And these axons were emptied of their original components.
            No connection with nucleus, no organelles => no ATP.

            And it worked! Just think about this riddle...
            Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. L VINCI
            We are to admit no more causes of natural things than such as are both true and sufficient to explain their appearances. I NEWTON

            Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not a bit simpler.
            If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. Albert Einstein
            bernard

            Comment


            • #7
              Debunking

              Dear Colleagues,
              Let me pay your attention to the article:

              Ling GN
              Debunking the alleged resurrection of the sodium pump hypothesis.
              Physiol Chem Phys Med NMR. 1997;29(2):123-98.

              Full text:
              http://www.bioparadigma.spb.ru/files...-Debunking.pdf

              Comment


              • #8
                Hi Vladimir and welcome to SomaSimple,

                I'm pleased you joined the board because I think we share some opinions/points of view about cell "functioning".

                We thought that your paper was perfectly appliable to many sciences at all.

                Of course, your level of expertise is far beyond ours but I hope we could discuss about complex things with simple words.

                ps: I'm very interested by neurons and I know that my little essay is simplistic. I'll enjoy if you could give your opinion and criticisms. The board allows open minded thinking.
                Last edited by bernard; 11-04-2006, 08:36 AM.
                Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. L VINCI
                We are to admit no more causes of natural things than such as are both true and sufficient to explain their appearances. I NEWTON

                Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not a bit simpler.
                If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. Albert Einstein
                bernard

                Comment


                • #9
                  For some reason my computer will not take on that new file.
                  I left it on all night and it told me this morning that it couldn't load it. I tried again just now and no luck. Bernard, would you send it to me by email so I can try that way?
                  Thanks,
                  Diane
                  www.dermoneuromodulation.com
                  SensibleSolutionsPhysiotherapy
                  HumanAntiGravitySuit blog
                  Neurotonics PT Teamblog
                  Canadian Physiotherapy Pain Science Division (Archived newsletters, paincasts)
                  Canadian Physiotherapy Association Pain Science Division Facebook page
                  @PainPhysiosCan
                  WCPT PhysiotherapyPainNetwork on Facebook
                  @WCPTPTPN
                  Neuroscience and Pain Science for Manual PTs Facebook page

                  @dfjpt
                  SomaSimple on Facebook
                  @somasimple

                  "Rene Descartes was very very smart, but as it turned out, he was wrong." ~Lorimer Moseley

                  “Comment is free, but the facts are sacred.” ~Charles Prestwich Scott, nephew of founder and editor (1872-1929) of The Guardian , in a 1921 Centenary editorial

                  “If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you, but if you really make them think, they'll hate you." ~Don Marquis

                  "In times of change, learners inherit the earth, while the learned find themselves beautifully equipped to deal with a world that no longer exists" ~Roland Barth

                  "Doubt is not a pleasant mental state, but certainty is a ridiculous one."~Voltaire

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Diane,

                    I made a copy on my computer. The server where the file is located is slow sometimes.
                    I will upload it but it is a bit heavy = 7.00 Mb
                    Last edited by bernard; 11-04-2006, 03:24 PM.
                    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. L VINCI
                    We are to admit no more causes of natural things than such as are both true and sufficient to explain their appearances. I NEWTON

                    Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not a bit simpler.
                    If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. Albert Einstein
                    bernard

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Here it is

                      http://www.somasimple.com/pdf_files/...-Debunking.pdf
                      Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. L VINCI
                      We are to admit no more causes of natural things than such as are both true and sufficient to explain their appearances. I NEWTON

                      Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not a bit simpler.
                      If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. Albert Einstein
                      bernard

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hi Vladimir,

                        I read the paper and I was already aware (by you) that it was an energy problem within cells.

                        I think but I may be wrond that cells are perpetuating an asymmetrical milieu because it creates the best conditions for life. This asymmetry produces effects that are ignored/rejected actually. many experiments essume that ions are equally organized but IMHO they are very close to membranes?
                        Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. L VINCI
                        We are to admit no more causes of natural things than such as are both true and sufficient to explain their appearances. I NEWTON

                        Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not a bit simpler.
                        If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. Albert Einstein
                        bernard

                        Comment

                        Working...
                        X