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Deconstruction of "Z-Health Performance Solutions"

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  • student
    replied
    I guess the RKC community and Z health have been having some hiccups. Since someone had mentioned Brett Jones earlier in the thread I thought I would post his little statement about it all.


    http://www.dragondoor.com/articler/m...m_nooverride=1

    Leave a comment:


  • NateM
    replied
    I have a few VHS tapes from Scott Sonnon when he labeled this stuff "Zedrovye", apparently after the Soviet mobility secrets. There are several maneuvers on those tapes that look familiar to the "Z" health stuff....I'm sure that's what the "Z" refers to.

    Leave a comment:


  • regnalt deux
    replied
    Originally posted by Jason Silvernail View Post
    Todd- This is the classic Applied Kinesiology trick with a different name.
    Exactly, Jason.

    Btw I was recently gifted a few of the Z-Health products. Essentially, Dr. Cobb has combined, in no specific order, different aspects of Scott Sonnon's Intu-Flow (talk about a guy with a questionable background!), Pavel Tsatsouline's Russian Mobility Drills, Vision Therapy, AK, Hanna Somatics, bits and pieces of neuroscience, and a few other "ingredients" as well. I've studied most of this stuff too, with the exception of AK, and a lot of it has merit IF used within the proper context. Long story (somewhat) shorter the overall issue I have with Z-health is that it's completely based on a bio-mechanical, mesoderm oriented, construct...there's no somatic awareness through motion ala Feldenkrais/Hanna, but "fixing" the nervous system with joint mobility. I could go on forever, but you get my point....
    ________
    BMW E38 specifications
    Last edited by regnalt deux; 30-01-2011, 05:38 AM.

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  • Johnny_Nada
    replied
    If this rationale was actually valid, every time I squat (total body joint jamming) I would crumble to the ground....

    or should I use the DRX-9000 to increase my PR's......:thumbs_do

    Leave a comment:


  • Jason Silvernail
    replied
    Todd- This is the classic Applied Kinesiology trick with a different name.

    Leave a comment:


  • regnalt deux
    replied
    I?m very disappointed in the video: http://www.youtube.com/zhealthvideos

    Dr. Cobb tests the hamstring strength of a person lying prone. The first test at :38 seconds into the video is done with a very mild push to seemingly ensure a strong test result. Next, he ?shuts off? the hamstring at 1:09 by ?jamming? the heel bone and retests with more effort, and from a slightly different angle, to make the hamstring appear weaker. At 1:32 into the video he ?makes the hamstring stronger? by mobilizing the heel and appears to once again push softly to guarantee the results. Lastly, at 2:02 into the video he ?turns the hamstrings back off? by gripping the heel and REPOSITIONS HIMSELF to get more leverage and the person?s hamstrings test weak. It?s very obvious, at least from my perspective, that Dr. Cobb is trying to (unconsciously) get the result he wants.
    ________
    Ford Focus (international)
    Last edited by regnalt deux; 30-01-2011, 05:37 AM.

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  • atx4
    replied
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d977d7NmOyQ

    ...thoughts?

    there are plenty more vids:
    http://www.youtube.com/zhealthvideos

    Leave a comment:


  • Strawfoot
    replied
    The good "Dr" Eric Cobb has a blog. He doesn´t like people questioning his systems claims of "science" he just want to them to pay good money and shut up.

    http://www.zhealth.net/node/376

    It´s quite obvious that his blog entry is a response to a certain thread that has now surfaced on the dragondoor forum

    Nice to know that the good doctor reads this forum. Quotes Winston Churchill as well does he. "Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing ever happened."

    Better hurry on doctor, hurry on :clap2:
    /Martin

    Leave a comment:


  • NateM
    replied
    The problem I have with Z-Health is the amount pseudo-scientific claims made by it's proponents who can't back them up with any real science; they can only use scientific sounding words that sound good to the average fitness or health enthusiast.
    Keats, nice to have you back.

    I received an email about becoming a "Master" with the group and all of the "levels" that would go with it. In the email was a list of the recent "Master Z-Health" Trainers, with a full article about how one young woman failed on her first attempt to pass the final test and had to spend 2 more days being "grilled" by the founder, asking her question after question for 2 hours. Thankfully *whew* she passed after the whole ordeal.

    Man, I was pulling for her! Passing an un-recognized certification offered by one man. Makes me think all of that time in grad school was easy!

    Nate

    Leave a comment:


  • Jason Silvernail
    replied
    Hi Jim.
    I think you'll find lots of good options that don't depend on a lack of understanding of the physiology of the human body. It might be helpful to start a new thread with your question - that sounds like a great topic!

    Leave a comment:


  • jmsims2
    replied
    I sure am glad I found this website. I am exactly as someone described in this very thread, smart enough to be dangerously ignorant! At least I am aware of it now, right?! Anyways, as a weekend athlete who lifts weights and plays recreation sports, what would be recommended for mobility and keeping healthy? Would Feldenkrais be something to look into in this regard? Like I said, I am smart enough to know I need to do something to keep my joints moving well, but dumb enough to nearly spend a lot of money to learn the "secrets"! Thanks for any help...

    Leave a comment:


  • Keats Snideman
    replied
    Originally posted by Strawfoot View Post
    And by the looks of it it´s working like a charm. They have managed to find quite a willing herd in the kettlebell comunity, giving all kind of outrageous statements and supporting it with "solid neuroscience". It´s quite remarakble they get away with it really. By the looks of it they managed to get Brett Jones on the bandwagon as well.
    Yes, the kettlebell community has embraced Z-Health big time. As I've said in the past on this thread, I don't have a problem with people trying Z-health or any other kind of movement exploration that might make one feel and function better. The problem I have with Z-Health is the amount pseudo-scientific claims made by it's proponents who can't back them up with any real science; they can only use scientific sounding words that sound good to the average fitness or health enthusiast. A tremendous "placebo-like" effect appears to be at work here with all the "priming" they do with their students/clients hleping them to expect a great benefit.

    Clearly, movement of any kind can be beneficial if it is done with purpose, attention and awareness (a la Feldenkrais movements) and I indeed have taken a couple of Z-health moves to incorporate into my own daily movement/warm-up repitoire that I am constantly tweaking and changing as I learn and explore about my body. I also have used ideas from Pavel Tsatsoulline in his Super Joints book as well as the very Woo-oriented Scott Sonnon. No one person has a patent on human movement! Each can only have their own biased opinion and version of what they think human movement should be like.

    I wish Mel Siff were still alive; I'd love to hear what he would say about all these cult-like followings that are gaining more and more numbers all the time!
    Mel would be have much to say about these matters!

    Since all of these people have certifications, and if one is charge exorbant amounts of money for certifications, I guess you have to make your stuff sound really sciency and official to encourage the participants to keep drinking the kool-aid!

    Leave a comment:


  • Strawfoot
    replied
    Originally posted by Keats Snideman View Post
    the Z-Health groupies are really using classical chiropractic snake-oil salesmanship at it's best!
    And by the looks of it it´s working like a charm. They have managed to find quite a willing herd in the kettlebell comunity, giving all kind of outrageous statements and supporting it with "solid neuroscience". It´s quite remarakble they get away with it really. By the looks of it they managed to get Brett Jones on the bandwagon as well.

    Leave a comment:


  • Keats Snideman
    replied
    Thanks for the replies everyone! I knew it was BS but wanted to see what you guys thought since I know most here couldn't possibly accept such a simple., black and white answer.

    The video kind of reminded me of a recent incident I had with gentleman here in AZ who "muscle tested" me before and after I drank his special vitamin/mineral water for athletes. He clearly expected me to be stronger after I sipped his magic water; the Z-Health groupies are really using classical chiropractic snake-oil salesmanship at it's best!

    Leave a comment:


  • Barrett Dorko
    replied
    I think this guy should seek out a job working for Cross Country Seminars or Summit Professional Education. He's just what these continuing ed companies are looking for: direct, quick results, no ambiguity, seemingly rational "theory" that will never be challenged by the audience looking for "something that works quickly and can be immediately applied in the clinic" and he uses terms they think they understand.

    He also dresses much like a lot of my colleagues, and I always wear a tie. What a nerd.

    Leave a comment:

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