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  • Originally posted by Ken Jakalski View Post
    Hi Keats!

    I remember you from your posts over at Supertraining!

    You noted the following about Cobb's approach:



    I'm sorry if I keep returning the the paralympian sprinters on these kinds of issues, but watching these guys run and jump on my track back in '97 became my 'epiphany' moment on issues relative to imbalances and asymmetries during high speed running.

    Volpentest was born without lower arms and feet. In fact, when you look closely at his prosthetics, you'll see that one limb is actually longer than the other. Nevertheless, he was able to run 22.94 for 200 meters, a time faster than that run by the majority of able bodied high school sprinters I've ever coached over the past thirty-six years.

    I suppose that, if you don't have a left wrist, you don't have a right ankle problem. But what about single below the knee amputees like Marlon Shirley, the paralympic world champion for 100 meters? Maybe his explanation would suggest some other means of neurological compensation.

    My take is that these kinds of peformances should compel us to at least reconsider our theories on the "human gait cycle."
    Wow, I can't believe this thread is still here after I started it some years back! I haven't posted on the site in a few years but thought I'd check in to see what was new (or old)! Ken, I do miss those incredible conversations on the old Supertraining Forums from the early 2000's! I really wish Mel Siff were still around today; he would have had some great input on this Z-Health Thread!
    Keats Snideman CSCS, LMT
    "Keep an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out."

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    • Keats,

      Thank you for starting this thread! This is how I find SomaSimple. I was searching for info on Z-Health and this popped up in the search results. I've been here ever since, and my practice is far better for it!
      Novice Woo Shoo Kung Foo practitioner. Experienced critic of Truthiness.
      "It used to be, everyone was entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts. But that's not the case anymore. Facts matter not at all...Truthiness is 'What I say is right, and [nothing] anyone else says could possibly be true.' " - Stephen Colbert

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      • Hello everyone

        Sorry to necro; I saw this thread pop up on the "Who's on-line" list. To add just a soupcon of detail:

        AFAIK, Z-Health is based on an older package called "Zdorovye", which in itself is based on ROSS (A kind of Slavic martial art gestalt method, akin to Systema). I remember when Zdorovye, ROSS and Grappler's Toolbox came out (circa 2000?). To my understanding, Dr Cobb and co and the originator of Zdorovye system went in separate directions. Suggest interested parties peruse bullshido.com as to the nature of the fracas.

        The last time I checked (again, circa 2000! Caveat lector), Z-health was based on joint range of motion methods employed in martial arts, 'fear re-activity' inoculation drills, methods employing stretch-shortening cycles, plyometrics and other novel movements.

        This - yet again - bolsters my contention that a lot of things that originate from the martial arts end up in the therapy domain.

        [YT]6okF3IzP8No[/YT]

        BTW, there's a video on the Zhealth webpage (see: Get out of pain retrain your brain that may be of interested if not mentioned already)
        Last edited by Dan84; 05-08-2013, 09:23 PM.
        Dan
        Tactile Raconteur

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        • Here's a talk indicating that some of the ZHealth people are starting to "get it" with regards to modern pain science.

          http://youtu.be/W0UxZ7PZ2L4
          Novice Woo Shoo Kung Foo practitioner. Experienced critic of Truthiness.
          "It used to be, everyone was entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts. But that's not the case anymore. Facts matter not at all...Truthiness is 'What I say is right, and [nothing] anyone else says could possibly be true.' " - Stephen Colbert

          Comment


          • New Z-Health Video on Training for Symmetry

            I saw this video today (a colleague sent it to me to ask my opinion) and thought I'd post it here since its been a while since I've joined in on this old thread! This is an interesting concept that Dr. Cobb puts forward but I still have such a hard time buying into the "test-retest" strategies used here. I guess I just don't really see the point of basing your training on such isolated movements.

            I for one would never be able to train either arm according to the tests since my internal rotation is quite limited in that scarecrow position.

            http://zhealtheducation.com/episode-...da8188d79b38af

            Thoughts??
            Keats Snideman CSCS, LMT
            "Keep an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out."

            Comment


            • Eyes rolling to back of head...

              Sounds like a lot of manual therapist approaches
              "The views expressed here are my own and do not reflect the views of my employer."

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              • A nice marketing strategy.

                Cannot disagree with what he did. But disagree with what he said particularly the underlying mechanism of gaining the improvement.

                Regards,

                Weni

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                • To the best of my knowledge most of the exercises from the ZHealth System can be found in Scott Sonnon's Zdorovye Health System, which has morphed over the years, re-branded, into new trademarks essentially. Zdorovye had joint ROM exercises which involved bidirectional circles, figure 8's, then combined. Also ground work that looked similarly to body weight conditioning exercises one would learn in judo or wrestling. Sonnon termed this the grapplers tool box. The new variants are called Intu-Flow (Zdorovye) and Tacfit (grapplers toolbox).

                  You can find many video's using those search terms on youtube. Also look up primal movement as an umbrella search term and you'll find even more comparable movement systems. Sonnon used to quote Feldenkrais and Thomas Hanna all the time, so it doesn't surprise me that concepts like sensory motor amnesia and the arthrokinetic reflex have been used in here and in their writings. I think Cobb has tried to marry good joint mobility training with modern neuroscience, but for the life of me I don't know how he has come up with 9 or 10 $2500.00 USD courses all with unique content? I don't think there is unique content in all of them.

                  Someone, I think Regnalt Deux mentioned they've seen all the PDF's here. Does each level have independent material, or is it all dynamic joint mobility exercises with vestibulo-occular reflex exercises?

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