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  • Originally posted by Diane View Post
    Ex--atingly good info there, Thirdgen.

    It doesn't de-implicate chiro in general though.
    I didn't intend to "de-implicate chiro in general".

    Besides, I expect Scrushy is a fine, upstanding citizen.

    Comment


    • Then, what's your point, Thirdgen?

      Your link, while a worthy example of gross health care financial fraud, has nothing to do with the context of this thread.

      Are you trying to tell us, "See, PTs are frauds, too."

      For the record, Scrushy was trained as a respiratory therapist, and his organization, while certainly predominant in outpatient PT services, had just about all rehab-related professions, viz PT, OT, ST, ATC and even MDs, providing services in several different settings, including neurological and acute rehab.

      Scrushy is now a convicted felon. Is that your idea of a "fine, upstanding citizen," or are you just being sarcastic as well as cryptic with this series of postings?

      Why don't you tell us who your are and what point it is you're trying to make. I don't have the time or the inclination to decipher your wry wit.
      John Ware, PT
      Fellow of the American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists
      "Nothing can bring a man peace but the triumph of principles." -R.W. Emerson
      “If names be not correct, language is not in accordance with the truth of things. If language be not in accordance with the truth of things, affairs cannot
      be carried on to success.” -The Analects of Confucius, Book 13, Verse 3

      Comment


      • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kt5Kb...eature=related

        This 'crack head' (pun intended) actually states he uses PHYSICAL THERAPY to treat patients (idiot thinks that PT is ice/heat/e-stim)...last I checked that's not allowed.

        Now this is a purely speculative question....What would it take to expose chiropractic for what it is, thus eradicating it, or at least put it where it belongs?

        Everyone's reply is that they have more money to pay lobbyists, thus political pull/power. I saw a stat saying there are 137,000 PTs in the US and 41,000 chiros. There is no way they should have the political pull they do.


        Matt
        I may not be as smart as most people, but I'm sure as hell not as dumb....
        "The views expressed here are my own and do not reflect the views of my employer."

        Comment


        • You forgot to consider the trial lawyers in that equation. They tend to tip the scales quite a bit in the political arena. I still think the many chiros in the US are in the middle of a slow bleed however.
          Rod Henderson, PT, ScD, OCS
          It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into. — Jonathan Swift

          Comment


          • Rod,

            Sorry to forget the trial lawyers.....I still revert back to my previous question, what would it take to expose them for what they are? They are very good at getting what they want and restricting others from doing what is within their scope of practice, yet can/will say they do physical therapy. I see these offices on every corner and hear the garbage they fill peoples' brains with. I still know PT's, one i talked to yesterday, say her manipulations 'are very general and not as specific as a chiropractors.' Yes, i filled her in afterwards and pointed her toward various papers.

            I know this is/may be a useless fight, but in all honesty, they are the one 'health-care professional/doctor' that practices a method that is flawed in theory,completely invalid, and invented in one day by a magnet healer. Why, after >100 years are they still here?
            I may not be as smart as most people, but I'm sure as hell not as dumb....
            "The views expressed here are my own and do not reflect the views of my employer."

            Comment


            • They are still here because their marketing has hit all the right notes at the right time and changes as is needed. Simple as that.
              Barrett L. Dorko

              Comment


              • I know this is/may be a useless fight, but in all honesty, they are the one 'health-care professional/doctor' that practices a method that is flawed in theory,completely invalid, and invented in one day by a magnet healer. Why, after >100 years are they still here?
                GREAT question!

                I think the answer may lie somewhere in the carrying capacity of their environment. For something to exist, it exploits its environment. However, the other side of this is that the environment will support or at least tolerate that... what to call it... "life form"?

                Anyway, by exposing it, by naming it for what it is, by explaining it, by supporting all the efforts made by anyone/everyone out there who are also doing this, eventually the environment will become less tolerant/supportive etc.

                On the plus side, it's a (so-called) "profession" that based itself on a very, very narrow base of human primate social grooming. The more that base is eroded scientifically the more the (so-called) profession will topple over one day because of its own dead weight. It may take out orthopaedic manual therapy with it, when it comes crashing down in the Deep Dark Forest of Meso-doom. That will be a sad day for those who are our friends and who truly believed they were treating joints, but a glad day for reason and reality and neuroscience-based forms of treatment.
                Diane
                www.dermoneuromodulation.com
                SensibleSolutionsPhysiotherapy
                HumanAntiGravitySuit blog
                Neurotonics PT Teamblog
                Canadian Physiotherapy Pain Science Division (Archived newsletters, paincasts)
                Canadian Physiotherapy Association Pain Science Division Facebook page
                @PainPhysiosCan
                WCPT PhysiotherapyPainNetwork on Facebook
                @WCPTPTPN
                Neuroscience and Pain Science for Manual PTs Facebook page

                @dfjpt
                SomaSimple on Facebook
                @somasimple

                "Rene Descartes was very very smart, but as it turned out, he was wrong." ~Lorimer Moseley

                “Comment is free, but the facts are sacred.” ~Charles Prestwich Scott, nephew of founder and editor (1872-1929) of The Guardian , in a 1921 Centenary editorial

                “If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you, but if you really make them think, they'll hate you." ~Don Marquis

                "In times of change, learners inherit the earth, while the learned find themselves beautifully equipped to deal with a world that no longer exists" ~Roland Barth

                "Doubt is not a pleasant mental state, but certainty is a ridiculous one."~Voltaire

                Comment


                • Chiropractors billing for PT? Sued 11 million for doing that. Fraud! Bad chiro! Bad!
                  Diane
                  www.dermoneuromodulation.com
                  SensibleSolutionsPhysiotherapy
                  HumanAntiGravitySuit blog
                  Neurotonics PT Teamblog
                  Canadian Physiotherapy Pain Science Division (Archived newsletters, paincasts)
                  Canadian Physiotherapy Association Pain Science Division Facebook page
                  @PainPhysiosCan
                  WCPT PhysiotherapyPainNetwork on Facebook
                  @WCPTPTPN
                  Neuroscience and Pain Science for Manual PTs Facebook page

                  @dfjpt
                  SomaSimple on Facebook
                  @somasimple

                  "Rene Descartes was very very smart, but as it turned out, he was wrong." ~Lorimer Moseley

                  “Comment is free, but the facts are sacred.” ~Charles Prestwich Scott, nephew of founder and editor (1872-1929) of The Guardian , in a 1921 Centenary editorial

                  “If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you, but if you really make them think, they'll hate you." ~Don Marquis

                  "In times of change, learners inherit the earth, while the learned find themselves beautifully equipped to deal with a world that no longer exists" ~Roland Barth

                  "Doubt is not a pleasant mental state, but certainty is a ridiculous one."~Voltaire

                  Comment


                  • Does this belong in here?

                    This video is from Penn and Tellers' show called 'Bulls**t." If you don't know them, they are a comedian/magic duo from Las Vegas. It's a little bit on chiropractic. If you are offended by the use of four letter words, please DO NOT watch this.

                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uD_JPtsP-Q

                    Have a great weekend
                    I may not be as smart as most people, but I'm sure as hell not as dumb....
                    "The views expressed here are my own and do not reflect the views of my employer."

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by mrupe82 View Post
                      This video is from Penn and Tellers' show called 'Bulls**t." If you don't know them, they are a comedian/magic duo from Las Vegas. It's a little bit on chiropractic. If you are offended by the use of four letter words, please DO NOT watch this.

                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uD_JPtsP-Q

                      Have a great weekend
                      Yes, this belongs in here. Screamingly funny. clap2:
                      Diane
                      www.dermoneuromodulation.com
                      SensibleSolutionsPhysiotherapy
                      HumanAntiGravitySuit blog
                      Neurotonics PT Teamblog
                      Canadian Physiotherapy Pain Science Division (Archived newsletters, paincasts)
                      Canadian Physiotherapy Association Pain Science Division Facebook page
                      @PainPhysiosCan
                      WCPT PhysiotherapyPainNetwork on Facebook
                      @WCPTPTPN
                      Neuroscience and Pain Science for Manual PTs Facebook page

                      @dfjpt
                      SomaSimple on Facebook
                      @somasimple

                      "Rene Descartes was very very smart, but as it turned out, he was wrong." ~Lorimer Moseley

                      “Comment is free, but the facts are sacred.” ~Charles Prestwich Scott, nephew of founder and editor (1872-1929) of The Guardian , in a 1921 Centenary editorial

                      “If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you, but if you really make them think, they'll hate you." ~Don Marquis

                      "In times of change, learners inherit the earth, while the learned find themselves beautifully equipped to deal with a world that no longer exists" ~Roland Barth

                      "Doubt is not a pleasant mental state, but certainty is a ridiculous one."~Voltaire

                      Comment


                      • Wow.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTz7V...eature=related
                        Anders.
                        "There is nothing so practical as a good theory." -Kurt Lewin

                        Comment


                        • Anders - that is typical isn't it:
                          A good looking "professional" (notice the wavy hair, white coat), nice visuals (x-rays with "misalignments"), a confident attitude with sentences as "we WILL fix this" and, to top it off, a very cool looking machine doing something not-so-hard on the skin. Bingo.
                          All brought to you by the popular soap-image of the scrub wearing "hottie" doctors.....
                          We don't see things as they are, we see things as WE are - Anais Nin

                          I suppose it's easier to believe something than it is to understand it.
                          Cmdr. Chris Hadfield on rise of poor / pseudo science

                          Pain is a conscious correlate of the implicit perception of threat to body tissue - Lorimer Moseley

                          We don't need a body to feel a body. Ronald Melzack

                          Comment


                          • Crelin article

                            http://www.chirobase.org/02Research/crelin.html

                            An interesting article.
                            I may not be as smart as most people, but I'm sure as hell not as dumb....
                            "The views expressed here are my own and do not reflect the views of my employer."

                            Comment


                            • Bas,

                              I've seen The Doctors show on TV previously, but I never would have thought they would uncritically showcase this kind of treatment.. well well..
                              Anders.
                              "There is nothing so practical as a good theory." -Kurt Lewin

                              Comment


                              • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuUM7...1&feature=fvwp

                                I'm without words...
                                Frédéric Wellens, pht
                                «We often refuse to accept an idea merely because the tone of voice in which it has been expressed is unsympathetic to us.»
                                «
                                Those who cannot understand how to put their thoughts on ice should not enter into the heat of debate.
                                »
                                Friedrich Nietzsche
                                www.physioaxis.ca
                                chroniquesdedouleur blog

                                Comment

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