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  • #46
    "Speak ill of me if you will, but speak of me often"

    I can't remember where I heard this quote, but my old mentor used to use this phrase to describe negative attention-seeking behavior.

    Based on the replies here I'd say it's mission accomplished for Dr. E.
    Rod Henderson, PT, ScD, OCS
    It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into. — Jonathan Swift

    Comment


    • #47
      It seems as if the kind of reply folks enjoy making when they wish to dismiss the contributions of a particular individual or group is to come up with some line associating either their name or their group with some clever--often memorable--description.

      "Somasimpletons" is an example of this.

      My partner at our speed and performance training site is named Barry Ross. His nickname going back a long way is "Bear."

      Of course, those who dislike his approach to strength training refer to whatever he has to say as "Bear droppings."

      This is highly effective because many people finds these lines memorable--and then make the association.

      The way for an individual or group to combat that is to use the line themselves as if the the message is not at all troubling.

      In education, it's what I refer to as "cultivating a vice." I would often tell younger teachers that if they had a quirk or mannerism or odd behavior that they felt students seem to be seizing upon, the best way to combat that is to make light of it themselves.

      It's certainly not a unique approach, but being able to laugh at yourself for the very things others find laughable about you diminishes the impact of the intended insult.

      Comment


      • #48
        Here is a simple ton
        Attached Files
        Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. L VINCI
        We are to admit no more causes of natural things than such as are both true and sufficient to explain their appearances. I NEWTON

        Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not a bit simpler.
        If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. Albert Einstein
        bernard

        Comment


        • #49
          Rod,
          My assessment of Dr. E's approach is that he's setting the profession on the wrong track. To add insult to that, he's adding insult to that. Personal insults.

          I only go to his site when someone mentions it here. I've seen nothing from him that I haven't seen from many others who trumpet the latest neuroscience out of one side of their mouths while promoting needle-poking, neck cracking and/or face gouging from the other.

          I consider this duplicitous behavior (what else could you call it?) more dangerous to the profession and our patients than that of the totally uniformed/misinformed who just do traditional PT because they don't know or care about doing it any other way.

          So, I think the guy's a threat to the future of the profession. I wouldn't care if he didn't have as much influence as he appears to have. And, ya, when he makes it personal- he made it personal- it gives me a little more gumption to speak out.

          I've been doing this for almost 20 years now. After expending personal blood and treasure to reach what many would consider the pinnacle of OMPT, I've been threatened with lawsuits, I've been ostracisized, I've been fired, I've been marginalized, I've lost friends.

          The individuals behind all that had something in common, when you questioned their interpreation of the neuroscience, they all behaved like Dr. E has here.

          Barrett's right, this is a gift from Dr. E, DPT. I would just like to share it with others.
          John Ware, PT
          Fellow of the American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists
          "Nothing can bring a man peace but the triumph of principles." -R.W. Emerson
          “If names be not correct, language is not in accordance with the truth of things. If language be not in accordance with the truth of things, affairs cannot
          be carried on to success.” -The Analects of Confucius, Book 13, Verse 3

          Comment


          • #50
            Well Dr. E has revealed himself to all with his latest entry. I seems Joe is on track with what motivates Erson.

            He seems more interested in "free hits" while I'm interested in what's best for patients and the profession. Not saying Erson does not want what's best for the patient...just his interests and motivations are a little more "business" oriented than I think makes for an ideal situation for clear, reasoned and as non biased as possible... thinking.

            Comment


            • #51
              Who's surprised that Dr. E, DPT has a chronic pain problem?
              John Ware, PT
              Fellow of the American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists
              "Nothing can bring a man peace but the triumph of principles." -R.W. Emerson
              “If names be not correct, language is not in accordance with the truth of things. If language be not in accordance with the truth of things, affairs cannot
              be carried on to success.” -The Analects of Confucius, Book 13, Verse 3

              Comment


              • #52
                Just read the dry needling experience blog entry.
                my QL has not felt this soft in years!
                Are we talking about back pain or wrinkle cream?
                Rob Willcott Physiotherapist

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by Ken Jakalski View Post
                  It seems as if the kind of reply folks enjoy making when they wish to dismiss the contributions of a particular individual or group is to come up with some line associating either their name or their group with some clever--often memorable--description.

                  "Somasimpletons" is an example of this.
                  Good post Ken. In the HBO show Deadwood, Al Swearengen continually uses name calling in reference to other ethnic groups (or, just anybody he wanted to). This was explained as an attempt to dehumanize another group of individuals so as to not have to justify the completely unjustifiable treatment of these people. Name calling tends to be just another way to deflect issues and distract from the topic at hand. It usually comes from a place of insecurity on that individuals part.

                  Unfortunately, Dr. E's behavior is a symptom of a larger problem with the entire medical field. That is, an inability to critically think or accept scientific criticism without taking things personally. Defensiveness, ad-hominems, and name calling is about par for the course here. Much of this is because our field has not spent enough time on building a rational thought process on our treatment models, so when someone is questioned or critisized it is no surprise that their answers fall apart under scrutiny and they resort to name calling. I think there is a belief that many professionals hold that the initials behind their name free them from having to give a plausible explanation for their method, and that is evident with the rising use of "tools" in PT treatment, elevating rates of spinal fusions, cardiac stints, etc. Add into that the fact that people make their livelihood on these things, and it can get messy really quick.
                  Ryan Appell DPT
                  @Rappell_PT

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Unfortunately, Dr. E's behavior is a symptom of a larger problem with the entire medical field.
                    Yes, I agree that there's a larger problem, but I think that this physician has identified the reason why critical thinking is so rare.

                    I think we've got a little hubris going on in our profession, too.
                    John Ware, PT
                    Fellow of the American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists
                    "Nothing can bring a man peace but the triumph of principles." -R.W. Emerson
                    “If names be not correct, language is not in accordance with the truth of things. If language be not in accordance with the truth of things, affairs cannot
                    be carried on to success.” -The Analects of Confucius, Book 13, Verse 3

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Here is what I think is wrong with the profession:
                      Attached Files
                      Diane
                      www.dermoneuromodulation.com
                      SensibleSolutionsPhysiotherapy
                      HumanAntiGravitySuit blog
                      Neurotonics PT Teamblog
                      Canadian Physiotherapy Pain Science Division (Archived newsletters, paincasts)
                      Canadian Physiotherapy Association Pain Science Division Facebook page
                      @PainPhysiosCan
                      WCPT PhysiotherapyPainNetwork on Facebook
                      @WCPTPTPN
                      Neuroscience and Pain Science for Manual PTs Facebook page

                      @dfjpt
                      SomaSimple on Facebook
                      @somasimple

                      "Rene Descartes was very very smart, but as it turned out, he was wrong." ~Lorimer Moseley

                      “Comment is free, but the facts are sacred.” ~Charles Prestwich Scott, nephew of founder and editor (1872-1929) of The Guardian , in a 1921 Centenary editorial

                      “If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you, but if you really make them think, they'll hate you." ~Don Marquis

                      "In times of change, learners inherit the earth, while the learned find themselves beautifully equipped to deal with a world that no longer exists" ~Roland Barth

                      "Doubt is not a pleasant mental state, but certainty is a ridiculous one."~Voltaire

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by John W View Post
                        Yes, I agree that there's a larger problem, but I think that this physician has identified the reason why critical thinking is so rare.

                        I think we've got a little hubris going on in our profession, too.
                        great find John and much respect for Dr John to push the paper out there before it sinks in a sea of

                        ...

                        hubris


                        ANdy


                        now why can't physio's see they are just as, may even more, vulnerable????????????????
                        "Here is Edward Bear coming downstairs now, bump, bump, bump, on the back of his head behind Christopher Robin. It is, as far as he knows, the only way of coming downstairs, but sometimes he feels that there is another way, if only he could stop bumping for a moment and think of it." A.A. Milne

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Diane,
                          I agree with that, but that's what we do wrong. What's is actually wrong is a matter of professional integrity.

                          Let's face it, collectively we have a character problem. Willful ignorance is defect in character. I mean, come on, you can't gouge someone's face with a tool while you explain pain in a way that is neuroscientifically valid. These actions are based on mutually exclusive and immiscible principles. The most compelling principle that's come out of the work from Moseley and others is that patients are autonomous, intelligent and able individuasl, who are only different from us in that they are looking for a specific kind of help with a specific kind of problem. It's ludicrous how we've responded to that request for help. It's shameful, actually.

                          Until we face that and own it, Dr. E, DPT and the droves of others like him will continue to increase their S.O.E's (I have no idea what that is) and "likes" on Facebook.
                          John Ware, PT
                          Fellow of the American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists
                          "Nothing can bring a man peace but the triumph of principles." -R.W. Emerson
                          “If names be not correct, language is not in accordance with the truth of things. If language be not in accordance with the truth of things, affairs cannot
                          be carried on to success.” -The Analects of Confucius, Book 13, Verse 3

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            :thumbs_up :thumbs_up

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              PT's thinking like this definitely don't help things, this PT actually says he visits a chiro for treatment of back pain. This came from another forum. He stated earlier in the discussion that he's certified in two styles of spinal and extremity manipulation & one style of trigger point dry needling. The research and explanatory models are there, people just seem to be ignoring it. For background he had recommended a PT in florida advertise as chiropractor like treatments (chiropractor like manipulation and acupuncture like dry needling) to pop up in google searches more often. I went on to discuss not focusing on manipulation and dry needling and give patients more control. This is his response.

                              He states "As for the patient's reliance and locus of control - this almost reminds me of the "stuff" I've seen therapist posting on other forums about fear avoidance and Butler's work on the emotional aspect of physical therapy. My thoughts are based off of my clinical experience for the past 11 1/2 years-I see a recurrence of complaints that just simply come from the nature of our job duties, life stressors, etc. For example I find that people who sleep on their R sides with the R arm OH/under their pillows tend to develop "2nd rib syndrome" & people that do prolonged sitting often present with SIJD and associated C1 c/o's. Certainly in my patient education I suggest modifications of sitting and sleeping (for these examples), hence the patient's locus of control, but often times the symptoms recur. Or better yet, I seem to get a recurrence of LBP in which I periodically see a chiropractor (with immediate relief) even when I'm doing my due diligence of stretching and strengthening - it's my opinion that this is due to the nature of my job and will just recur. I don't think I'm being fixed, but simply that the spinal manipulation helps to disengage the sympathetic system and allow the muscle to relax (coupled of course with the soft tissue massage and trigger point dry needling I talk my wife into!). Anyway, I'm not looking for a heated debate or to steal a thread, I'm just not 100% in agreeance.
                              Mark Powers, PT, DPT, OCS
                              "Language is not neutral. It is not merely a vehicle which carries ideas. It is itself, a shaper of ideas."-Dale Spender

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                S.O.E

                                It should be SEO - Search Engine Optimisation. The route to the top of google where you come out on the top of or at least on the first page of a search.

                                Have we really come to this?

                                I had to look up immiscable. I think therapy and I may be immiscible.

                                ANdy

                                p.s.

                                I am unilaterally making the decision that- with over 1000 posts- you qualify as a "major contributor" to the site
                                you have been dazzled by the number and confused that with quality - most of them are drivel!
                                Last edited by amacs; 19-09-2013, 01:08 AM.
                                "Here is Edward Bear coming downstairs now, bump, bump, bump, on the back of his head behind Christopher Robin. It is, as far as he knows, the only way of coming downstairs, but sometimes he feels that there is another way, if only he could stop bumping for a moment and think of it." A.A. Milne

                                Comment

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