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  • #31
    Originally posted by TexasOrtho View Post

    Based on what the NIH funds these days, I figure that's good for a $250K grant.
    Only if you can connect it to alternative medicine through NCCAM, Rod...
    Jason Silvernail DPT, DSc, FAAOMPT
    Board-Certified in Orthopedic Physical Therapy
    Fellowship-Trained in Orthopedic Manual Therapy

    Certified Strength and Conditioning Specialist


    The views expressed in this entry are those of the author alone and do not reflect the official policy or position of the Department of the Army, Department of Defense, or the US Government.

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    • #32
      Hi Joe. I think the characteristics of correction are in the hypothesis realm at this point although they make sense from a plausibility standpoint. I agree that a study to see what, if any, patterns of sensation accompany a move toward relief is not only doable but would be most informative.

      A while back I posted this about the background or theory of simple contact on another sight (I was in a scrum with a couple of chiropractors over PT and chiro manip turf. I know, shocking. But it came up when they attempted to say that my stance in relation to simple contact made my asserions in that argument un-credible):

      It simply states that people will seek an end state of comfort if not compelled to do otherwise (a documented phenomenon called the end state comfort effect), that the mechanism of action is ideomotor movement (again documented), that a non-threatening context is necessary for expression toward this end state (consistent with placebo research for example), and that manual contact is one method (but not the only way) of communicating this context. It is hypothesized that this method may be effective at relieving mechanical pain only. This is testable and has preliminary evidence warranting further study.
      I know this doesn't relate to your specific questions about the "characteristics of correction" but I thought the end state comfort effect literature may be of some of value for you. Search that term and the author Rosenbaum. It is also referenced in the SSRD, references 10 and 11 I believe.
      Cory Blickenstaff, PT, OCS

      Pain Science and Sensibility Podcast
      Leaps and Bounds Blog
      My youtube channel

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      • #33
        I think this fits here, though it's rather long. Luke Rickards wrote it some time ago.

        Ideomotion can be described as instinctive, automatic expressions directly coupling dominant mental representations to action without intermediary volition (Carpenter, 1852; Spitz, 1997; Dorland, 2003). Ideomotor theory suggests that motor patterns can be automatically and intimately associated with their internal and external sensory effects, and will occur in the absence of any other cognitive representation or efferent motor command (Kunde et al., 2007). Although ideomotion has been commonly associated with non-volitional movements (Spitz, 1997), ideomotor theory also provides a compelling explanation for the generation of goal-oriented voluntary actions (Kunde et al., 2007; Keller et al., 2006). During ideomotor movements the sensory effects, such as the kinaesthetic and interoceptive sensations that may accompany each movement, are directly coupled with the generation of the movement itself (Knoblich & Prinz, 2005). Thus a kinaesthetic representation of a position that may be associated with reduced pain sensation, or stretch of a stiffened tissue, will be automatically coupled to the movement that produces the represented sensation. The pathway from sensory effect representation to movement may also involve feedback from the peripheral sensory apparatus at levels below attention, and this sensory input may facilitate the elaboration of motor patterns at higher levels (Cole, 2004). Alterations in motor output during the movement may be generated by continuing sensory effect representations and may be influenced by both conscious and non-conscious peripheral sensory feedback, thus resulting in the complex movement patterns seen during the intervention (Cole, 2004). Since varying interoceptive sensations may be perceived with even minute alterations in motor output in some instances movements may not be visible, though they will often still be palpable (Spitz, 1997).

        Chronic spinal pain is commonly associated with reduced or altered movement (Leeuw et al., 2007). Most approaches to spinal pain management incorporate movement of some kind into the treatment strategy, however the factors underlying the observed benefits of movement are unclear and both physical and psychological mechanisms have been proposed (Moseley, 2003; Slade & Keating, 2007; Leeuw et al., 2007). Resistance exercises with the aim of strengthening deconditioned tissue or to address impairments in control and stability are commonly prescribed for chronic pain, however unloaded movement facilitation exercises produce comparable effects (Slade & Keating, 2007). There is accumulating evidence that pain-related fear is a significant factor in reduced or altered movement in chronic pain and challenging these fears in the context of movement is also associated with improved outcomes (Leeuw et al., 2007; Woods & Asmundson, 2007; Moseley, 2003). Evidence from movement exposure in vivo studies examining fear-avoidance behaviours in chronic low back pain have emphasized the importance of practicing a wide variety of movements both during treatment and as home exercise (Leeuw et al., 2007). Although the intervention used in this study may be described as a manual therapy, it is an entirely active approach and mimics several aspects of both unloaded movement facilitation exercises and movement exposure in vivo.
        Barrett L. Dorko

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        • #34
          Great video Karen and Barrett. Thanks

          Idiomotion is something I have come across in various forms and contexts, as I am sure many have.

          One form is in the MFR “unwinding”. This, in the class I attended anyway, often degenerated to some cathartic form of thrashing around that, while on one level may be perceived as healing, on another level I believe must be seen as threatening.

          On many levels the body can not tell the difference between real and false danger which is why watching a horror movie will lead to a stress response in most of us. While at the end of a cathartic “unwind” the client is told they are safe, I find it difficult to accept that their nervous system perceives the event as safe during and immediately after this process.

          Contrast this to the poetic dance that Mike is doing in this video. I find it hard to understand that anyone, having seen both versions, could chose for the catharsis I witnessed in my MFR class.

          What a difference context makes.

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          • #35
            Yes, the "unwinding" spoken of and described endlessly by students of a certain practitioner is a specific mutation of expression.

            I have concluded that it's a great money maker.
            Barrett L. Dorko

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            • #36
              Barret, are you aware of the application of ideomotion in stage magic/mentalism ? On of the "cleanest" versions is, although there are several tricks to make it easier and just appear as if, to let someone hide an object (not seen by you, no stooges), then take his hand and let him lead you to the object by constantly focussing on the place, but without saying a word (using someone cooperative, who doesn't try to work against you of course...the latter usually being men). An interesting exercise to pratice.
              Jens

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              • #37
                I wrote years ago about Kreskin's use of this and he describes it in one of his books.

                So yes, I am aware. Thanks for bringing it up.
                Barrett L. Dorko

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                • #38
                  The operator uses osteopathy and Taoist technology
                  http://vk.com/video-43791081_1644860...b3b6a78e0b57e9

                  Simple Contact ?

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Dimitrii, Thank you for this.

                    I wouldn't disagree with this manner of care though I would probably improve the context a bit. Well, my version of improvement anyway. I appreciate there being no randomly used copying machine next to the patient's head; something I've endured in the past.

                    An explanation of Taoist Technology contains a number of terms and concepts I've endorsed in other writing as well.

                    The tendency for unconsciously generated thought (read instinctive and Wall's resolution) to become visibly active motion in response to permission that is verbal, non-verbal and tactile is what I guess you'd call my "method" but it seems necessary to read writers like Eagleman to explain it rationally.

                    I must say, if you use a term like Taoist Technology you're going to immediately face the derision of many people. In Ohio anyway. I personally have no problem with it but that's because of the culture my mother created for me in my youth.

                    I find it of some interest that Andrew Taylor Still articulated The Law of the Artery in the 1800s. I think there's something to it as far as pain with an origin of mechanical deformation goes.

                    Again, thank you for this.
                    Barrett L. Dorko

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                    • #40
                      I also found this, written long ago, connecting my method to Taoist philosophy, according to the link above.

                      And to think, I went to The Ohio State University.
                      Barrett L. Dorko

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                      • #41
                        Interesting video. The "patient's" movements appear almost spasmodic at times. I haven't experienced this with any patients whom I've been able to elicit what I would have to call ideomotion.

                        I wonder what role the variability in cultural "rules" about movement might play in how ideomotion may be expressed. We might need to consult an anthropologist.

                        I wish we could see the position of her feet.

                        Dmitri, are you able to translate any of the comments from the Toaist osteopath?
                        John Ware, PT
                        Fellow of the American Academy of Orthopedic Manual Physical Therapists
                        "Nothing can bring a man peace but the triumph of principles." -R.W. Emerson
                        “If names be not correct, language is not in accordance with the truth of things. If language be not in accordance with the truth of things, affairs cannot
                        be carried on to success.” -The Analects of Confucius, Book 13, Verse 3

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                        • #42
                          I wish there were a thank you multiplier on this forum. That is one of my favorite essays Barrett.
                          Rod Henderson, PT, ScD, OCS
                          It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into. — Jonathan Swift

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                          • #43
                            You're welcome Rod.

                            I've always liked that one too.
                            Barrett L. Dorko

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                            • #44
                              Barrett-

                              After reading your Samurai Therapist essay I immediately thought of this scene from the movie Forgetting Sarah Marshall

                              [YT]PKIpCPS-oZc[/YT]
                              Brent Cordery, PT

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                That's really funny Brent. I posted the exact same video several months ago in reference to my experience translating Barrett's lesson's.

                                Truly, the film is transcendent.
                                Rod Henderson, PT, ScD, OCS
                                It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into. — Jonathan Swift

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