ergotropic, tropotropic

[BB]

Anybody familiar with these terms? Ergotropic and tropotropic

If so, does anyone assess their patient's place in this continuum?

Cory

[bernard]

Cory,

I PubMeded ergotropic trophotropic and found 20 references but abstracts are old or unavailable.

[BB]

Hi Bernard,
One of my professors in PT school used these terms. I think that they are a description of a spectrum of whether a person is controlling, or passive.

I couldn't find a good reference yet either, but did fink this link about biofeedback:

http://www.minderlabs.com/kall.htm

Apparently it speaks of this in there somewhere, but I didn't find it yet. Anyway, looked interesting.

I'll post more later. I'm going to try to dig into my old school notes!

Cory

[bernard]

I found this
http://www.laceweb.org.au/hmb.htm#heal

The ergotropic system incorporates the functions of the following:



the sypathetic nervous system
certain endocrinal glands
portions of the reticular activating system in the brain stem
the posterior hypothalamus
potions of limbic system
the frontal cortex

The trophotropic system incorporates the functions of the following:



parasympathetic system
various endocrinal glands
portions of the reticular activating system
the anterior hypothalamus
portions of the limbic region
portions of the frontal cortex

[BB]

I found some descriptions of this continuum tonight. I've not taken the time to read through the original paper (see 1st link) which was from 1971, but I did also find a summary from 2001 in an EEG biofeedback site which I will include below.

The ergotropic, trophotrophic continuum seems to be a continuum or sympathetic and parasympathetic expression.

As I said before, I had a professor in PT school who considers his pt's along this continuum. Anybody familiar with these terms?

Arousal, Attention, and Affect
The conceptualization of brain function in terms of coupled systems was broached by W.R.Hess (1954). Experiments with electrical stimulation of regions of the diencephalon (thalamus and hypothalamus) in some instances led to very specific behavioral responses, and in other instances led to broad overall changes in behavior: arousal, quiescence, somnolence, torpor, and sleep. Hess subsumed these global changes in sympathetic and parasympathetic arousal in the terms ergotropia and trophotropia. The 'ergotropic shift' is characterized by a tendency toward higher sensory acuity, external focus, sympathetic arousal, high motor setpoint, etc. The 'trophotropic shift' is characterized, in contrast, by a tendency toward a more inward focus, less alertness, reduced sensory acuity, a shift toward vegetative functions, and a reduced motor system readiness. It is clear from our work that invoking either of these two shifts is possible with EEG biofeedback. What we refer to as "beta" training (15 to 18 Hz) is to be identified with a global ergotropic shift in organismic function, and that of "SMR" training (12 to 15 Hz) is to be identified with a trophotropic shift. The response of an individual to even a single session of EEG biofeedback training can make this quite obvious, an assertion which is independent of any claims for long-term efficacy of training.

Long-term EEG training has the effect of exercising and expanding the brain's ability to move freely along the continuum of ergotropic or trophotropic dominance, with all its implications for arousal, attentional state, and affect regulation. This brain exercise moves the individual into regions where he or she may not heretofore have been able to reside comfortably or stably. This is made possible not only by increased flexibility of state, but by an increased ability to maintain overall nervous system stability. The reason that two primary training regimens (higher and lower frequency) are sufficient is attributable to the fact that the ergotropic shift and the trophotropic shift are mutually inhibitory. To enhance the one is to suppress the other, as was already apparent to Hess. Gellhorn (1967) originally referred to the dynamic balancing of the ergotropic and trophotropic domains in terms of 'tuning' of the nervous system. The EEG biofeedback, by explicit appeal to rhythmic mechanisms, may be seen as a particularly efficacious agency of 'nervous system tuning.'

The brain's intrinsic bias toward homeostasis dictates that any training which evokes a brain response away from its then- prevailing equilibrium state will set in train forces to restore the original state. Thus, promoting an ergotropic shift will in first order tend to produce such a shift, and on the other, set in train compensatory mechanisms by which the brain restores the state it had intended for itself. Hence, even dis-equilibration can bring about improved equilibrium maintenance as a long-term consequence.

http://www.mimbres.com/holp/holpath/cartog.htm

Cory

[BB]

I found some more info here. Still pretty dated, but a person named Gellhorn proceeded with the ergo/trophotropic continuum. Interestingy, this passage is from a paper I found written by Peter Levine, who is the author of "Waking the Tiger" mentioned often by Barrett, I believe.

Here is the link to the full paper.
http://www.traumahealing.com/art_thesis.html

Simply, if one branch of the ANS, for whatever reason, becomes dominant,[12] then the responsiveness of the other becomes diminished over a period of time; which is to say that the tuning has become enhanced (and will lead to further tuning of that branch). In this way the restorative homeostatic potential is diminished. In addition, Gellhorn notes phenomena whereby one branch becomes tuned to such a degree that “reversal” occurs: Stimuli which normally evoke an ergotropic response will, in a trophotropically tuned situation, elicit instead a trophotropic response.

Obviously, understanding the dynamics of these processes and the “real life situations” which initiate (and which block) them will be important to the understanding, prevention, and treatment of clinical conditions deriving from this loss of reciprocal capacity.

It will be argued in subsequent chapters that situations which militate against the resolution of stress (and for its accumulation) can be grouped into three basic types, which are not meant to be absolute but broad and partially independent classes:

1) Those in which the level of activation has become so intense that the organism’s central processing machinery is unable to integrate the stress into an appropriate mode of discharge.

2) Those in which the buildup of charge is so slow (i.e., as in chronic low grade “environmental” or “social” stress) that the mechanisms of rebound are not activated and in which a more acute (though by itself moderate and resolvable) stress response is evoked on that background and becomes accumulated.

3) This in which the somatic (motoric) component of the discharge has been blocked from full or appropriate expression.

Cory

[bernard]

Hello all,

made a pdf version.

[Diane]

I haven't heard these terms before BB. What field do they come from?

[BB]

Hi Diane,
I'm not sure yet. Still investigating.
Cory

[Barrett Dorko]

I am certain that I own Gellhorn's text Somatic-Autonomic Integrations and have quoted from it since the early 80s. I do this from memory which is just as well because I tried hard today but couldn't find the doggone thing anywhere. The good news is that I certainly came across some interesting stuff I had forgotten I had. Anyway, This book published, I believe, in 1960 led me toward the nervous tissue as a primary problem because Gellhorn claims that muscular nociception enhances trophotropic response. Given the relatively few people in pain with a highly set parasympathetic system that we see, I started looking at other tissue.

Of course, I stopped when I got to the fascia. Ha, ha, just kidding. Seriously, Koizumi in The Neurobiologic Mechanisms in Manipulative Therapy makes the case that nervous and skin (same embryologic origin) tissue will make you sympathetic dominant when irritated. Put the two books together and you have the physiologic signiture of an abnormal neurodynamic - sympathetic dominance.

I'm pretty sure that Gellhorn speaks of a simultaneous rise in both arms of the ANS in severly involved patients and I think I've seen this. I never help such problems. Maybe I should look at their fascia. Sorry, I can't stop.

I'd love to see more about all of this here.

[BB]

Thanks Barrett.
I'm currently reading "Why Zebra's Don't Get Ulcer" by Robert Sapolsky. He describes the simultaneous buildup of sympathetic and parasympathetic systems while trying to maintain allostasis as being similar to 2 elephants balancing each other on a see saw. If one gets off it's going to be a bad situation.
It seems that the continuum of ergo-trophotropic concerns arousal as it relates to sympathetic/parasympathetic.
I'm not finding in my old notes from my PT school professor (Barrett you're mentioned in there, by the way) exactly how he does this, but he looks at their ergo/tropho state. I'm assuming that he means he is assessing their amount of sympathetic/parasympathetic arousal. I did have a notation that I wrote in stating "don't break the ergotropic continuum" under this section. Any ideas what this means?
Maybe it means don't mess around and knock one of those elephants off the see saw!

Cory

[Jon Newman]

I didn't have the paper exploring muscular nociception but I might have some other references to that effect. I'll have to check. I did have this old article by Gellhorn titled "The consequences of the suppression of overt movements in emotional stress: A neurophysiological interpretation (Confin. neurol. 31: 289-299, 1969). In it he states the following in the introduction:

It has often been said that the autonomic reactions which are appropriate under conditions of fight or flight are useless and even harmful if they occur in civilized man in situation in which this physical solution of a mental conflict is not feasible. To CANNON the former seem to reflect the wisdom of the body whereas the latter appear to HAMBURG an expression of its stupidity. Although the understanding of the basic problem is not furthered by the application of the anthropomorphic terms they help to focus attention on the interrelatedness of autonomic and somatic effects. In view of the fact that emotional stresses are thought to contribute to many diseases an attempt is made in this paper to present a neurophysiological analysis of the processes which accompany certain emotions while the overt motor expression of this state either takes place or is interfered with by extraneous means or by willed suppression.

Later he states:

We speak with HESS of ergotropic effects if signs of increased sympathetic activity are accompanied by cortical desynchronization (arousal) and enhanced motor discharge, whereas trophotropic effects are characterized by increased parasympathetic activity, cortical synchronization (as in sleep) and lessened tone of the striated muscle.

In summary he states:

Brief intense stimulation of the ergotropic (sympathetic) division of the hypothalamus is followed by a rebound after cessation of stimulation indicating a shift of the ergotropic-trophotropic balance to the trophotropic (parasympathetic) side which is associated with rest and relaxation. If the stimulation is prolonged the ergotropic system shows afterdischarges which inhibit the development of a trophotropic rebound. Data are presented which suggest that the rebound is involved in the quick termination of an emotion in fight and flight whereas in the absence of overt movements the continuation of the ergotropic excitation in the post-stimulatory period leads, on repeated exposures, to neuroses.

[BB]

Sorry, but I'm going to try to summarize that summary.

It sounds as though a sympathetic response(ergotropic) normally brings about a parasympathetic response(trophotropic) which also brings about resolution.
However, prolonged exposure to sympathetic response blunts the parasympathetic rebound, and in absence of "overt movements" the reponse continues to become more sympathetically flavored.


Also,
What would a person who has high egotrophic AND high trophotrophic representation look like?

Cory

[Jon Newman]

Hi Cory,

No need to apologize. I think your summary of the summary is on target. Here is one more statement from the article

Repeated exposure to situations evoking strong ergotropic excitation may lead to a spilling over of the ergotropic excitation into the trophotropic system indicating a breakdown of the reciprocity principle which regulates the ergotropic-trophotropic balance under physiological conditions. Neurotic syndromes (anxiety, motor disturbances) are seen at the same time.

The main point in me posting this is simply to bring some historical information to the thread. I've not seen studies that speak to simultaneous stimulus of both systems. In general the studies I've seen looked at the cycling. See the following abstract for a more recent example

Authors Maschke C. Hecht K.

Title Stress hormones and sleep disturbances - electrophysiological and hormonal aspects. [Review] [28 refs]

Source Noise & Health. 6(22):49-54, 2004 Jan-Mar.

Abstract In noise effect research often the awakening reaction is maintained to be the only important health related reaction. The main argument is that sleep represents a trophotropic phase ("energy storing"). In contrast to this awakening reactions or lying awake belong to the ergotropic phase ("energy consuming"). Frequent or long awakening reactions endanger therefore the necessary recovery in sleep and, in the long-run, health. Findings derived from arousal and stress hormone research make possible a new access to the noise induced nightly health risk. An arousal is a short change in sleeping condition, raising the organism from a lower level of excitation to a higher one. Arousals have the function to prevent life-threatening influences or events through activation of compensation mechanisms. Frequent occurrences of arousal triggered by nocturnal noise leads to a deformation of the circadian rhythm. Additionally, the deep sleep phases in the first part of the night are normally associated with a minimum of cortisol and a maximum of growth hormone concentrations. These circadian rhythms of sleep and neuroendocrine regulation are necessary for the physical as well as for the psychic recovery of the sleeper. Noise exposure during sleep which causes frequent arousal leads to decreased performance capacity, drowsiness and tiredness during the day. Long-term disturbances of the described circadian rhythms have a deteriorating effect on health, even when noise induced awakenings are avoided.

[Barrett Dorko]

I think that someone with a simultaneous increase in both arms of the ANS sounds and looks depleted, they are emotionally drained and lack the affect you'd expect to accompany their legitimate complaints of pain.

"This is killing me," they say, as if describing what they had for breakfast.

Much of what I do ends up being about shaping behavior. In order to do this effectively I need some behavior to shape - and that's what these people lack. Perhaps this describes a patient after some period of centrally produced pain.

[nari]

I think I have seen many of these people; but the problem is sorting out what the drugs are doing to them plus their ANS effects.
Emotive language (killing, destroying, murdering,unbearable,torturing) combined with flat effect unfortunately 'labels' them as somewhat incredible. Society is used to people in pain expressing it visibly - perhaps crying, tearful, or trying hard to be brave, etc) These folk don't do that, usually. They have a zombie appearance, sometimes; and it appears to be a kind of armour.

When the armour /shield is broached with resolving movement, the difference is paramount. Unfortunately it may not last; but at least they do experience that 'chink' in the masking.

Nari

[crawlars8977]

Hi:

I have been working on severe personal stress issues. I came across an ad in a magazine for a device called the Stresseraser that claims to work with ergotropic phenomenom (via biofeedback)...I haven't bought one and am still googling/researching and getting comfortable with the device's claims...but it sounds very interesting. Google "Stresseraser" and visit the site...there are couple of other links of interest there too.


crawlars

[Randy Dixon]

Googling it I saw lots of things like what is posted below, that is those of rather dubious scientific validity. Those terms seem familiar to me and I'm trying to figure out why.

http://72.14.205.104/search?q=cache:ptQ7ehW1xSQJ:www.laceweb.org.au/hmb.htm+ergotrophic&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=4

HEALING, PEAK EXPERIENCES AND THE ERGOTROPIC & TROPHOTROPIC SYSTEMS

CONTENTS:



Introduction

Functions Incorporated in the Ergotropic System

Ergotropic Activation

The Ergotropic System's Function

Organic indicators of Ergotropic Arousal

Functions Incorporated in the Trophotropic System

The Trophotropic System's Function

Organic indicators of Trophotropic Arousal

Complementarity of the Ergotropic and Trophotopic Systems

Prolonged Ergotropic Reactivity

Tuning

Top down and Bottom Up Tuning

Ergotropic and Trophotropic Drivers

Ergotropic and Trophotropic Events During Extraordinary Phases of Consciousness

Hyper-trophotropic Tuning

Hyper-ergotropic Tuning

Hyper-trophotropic Tuning with Ergotropic Eruption

Hyper-ergotropic Tuning With Trophotropic Eruption

Driving and Peak Experiences



INTRODUCTION

The Mindbody is massively integrated. As an aid to understanding, people have named various 'systems' within the mindbody. For example, the endocrinal system, the digestive system and the cardio-vascular system. Each of these are systems embodying many other systems. Everything is pervasively interactive. The mindbody is so integrated that it makes sense and aids understanding to give names to meta-systems, that is, systems embracing a number of others systems. There is, for example, the integration of the autonomic system, some somatic systems and higher neural systems. The mindbody system that 'controls' among other things the distribution and use of metabolic energy in the body may be conceived as being composed of two systems. One system is called the ergotropic system and the other the trophotropic system. Note that the word 'control' was in inverted commas. When everything tends to integrate with everything, the notion of control becomes slippery in many senses. As we will see, many aspects of the mindbody and outside stimuli may act as iniators or cataylsts for system change.

The ergotropic system and the trophotropic system are sometimes chacterised as antagonistic. That is, as one activates, the other tends to deactivate. The relationship between the two systems is better thought of as complementary. In some contexts both system may peak simultaneously.

FUNCTIONS INCORPORATED IN THE ERGOTROPIC SYSTEM

The ergotropic system incorporates the functions of the following:


the sypathetic nervous system
certain endocrinal glands
portions of the reticular activating system in the brain stem
the posterior hypothalamus
potions of limbic system
the frontal cortex
ERGOTROPIC ACTIVATION

The ergotropic system is activated when there is the possibility of responding to stimuli. The system may arouse the entire mindbody for action (especially threat) or arouse some portion of it. It may have extremely quick response times.

THE ERGOTROPIC SYSTEM'S FUNCTION

The ergotropic system's function:


The principal function is the control of short range, moment-by-moment adaptation to events in the world
It gears the mindbody to initiate and carry out action - often extremely quickly
It's particularly connected to fight/flight/avoidance behaviors
The systems activation shunts the body's metabolic energy away from long-range developmental activities
It enables the expenditure of vital resources
Bronchi are opened
It mediates stress relative to events in the world
Historically, it allows us to eat without been eaten
ORGANIC INDICATORS OF ERGOTROPIC AROUSAL

Organic indicators of ergotropic arousal:


shivering
paling of skin (constriction of surface veins and capillaries)
dilated pupils
increased heart rate and blood pressure
increased muscle tension
expenditure of vital resources
dry mouth (decreased salivation)
endocrine system releases chemicals that increase effectiveness of muscles
digestion stops
constriction of throat
desynchronised EEG
ejaculation
increased breathing rate with shallower breathing
erection of body hair (hair stands on end)
experiencing positive or aversive emotion
associated objects or events typically perceived as: