No Rule ** Pain **Enemy

[emad]

Hi all;

I do NOT like any more to treat pain !
It does not go under one rule !
I like dealing in straight manner !
Pain always decieved me !
I did lot of effort to understand it, no way!
Sometimes I feel it is outside, it exists , but i can not see him !
No science works with pain !
Pain is a stealer !
Steals me NOT the patient !
He conqures me NOT the Patient ! :evil:
I think sometimes he feels happy to get me crazy!
He likes to see me turning around !
He enjoys seeing me losing the way !
I do not respect my Enemy "Pain"
At all


Regards
Emad

[EricM]

Emad,
Do you feel better now?
The pen is mightier than the sword!

eric

[nari]

emad

The patient's CNS is testing you out, not the pain as much.

It takes a LONG time for it to make sense.

It is the most scientific thing we have to work with in terms of EBM

It obeys the laws of science - it is just that we don't always understand those laws, when we can't feel, hear or see in any way this emotion called pain.

Read as much as you can, emad - preferably not older than 2002 work.



Nari

[bernard]

Emad,

Pain is Not the enemy. It is our daily friend. We are not making war but learning with the Enemy. When you understand this principle then you begin to be convinced that pain is not an external identity but simply... You!

(A bit philosophic? :oops: )

[BB]

Hi Emad,
I must say that I can sympathize. There is so much to know, so many factors, so much to learn....And just because you know it, doesn't mean it is easy to teach it to the patients.
Sometimes I feel that the more I learn and try the worse I do, but then a good response happens and it helps me to tie things together a bit.
Sometimes I feel that I got a better response when I was operating in ignorance, before I started to learn about persistent pain and pain neurophysiology.
It is definately a different animal, and I write this only to let you know that you are not alone in your feelings.

Cory

[nari]

Hang in there guys.... it's worth it.


....when I started to learn about neurodynamics in the very early 1990s, i thought it would then 'resolve' many vague pain patterns that did not respond to the usual mobilisations, modalities, stretches, strengthening and so on. As there is very little evidence for the 'usual' and mounting evidence for neurodynamics/neuromatrices/brain modulating influences...
it's great.
Feels to me like finally physiotherapy might be moving out of the middle ages. But I feel comfortable with neuro stuff; and hate orthopaedic thinking with an unreasonable degree.

In the end, whatever you feel comfortable with, will work.


nari

[emad]

Hi Friends:

Actually , i do not know why i wrote previous words , but so clear they make sense for most of you.

No matter I am dealing with the CNS /pain .Ok ,but the main point to make physical feeling that we really deal with true identity .


No , Nari ,at all what are the bases/laws you are speaking about that the CNS (pain) respect in his dealing with us .No evidences ,no research , no science , this is so clear Nari , we can not deny that fact , we can skip over that , just we are trying to convince ourselves that we do not lose resources and time for useless stuff.

Eric :
The Pen is mighter than the Sword!!
English is not my First Language , so that I can not realise your meaning , i tried to search for that say(sentence ) , but i got lost , I hope any one from those first English speakers clearify for me :idea: :arrow:


Bernard :
I think the best way to deal with pain/CNS to Negotiate


Cory :
You are the only one agreed with me .


Friends, I will try to write soon , like to see your posts


Regards
Emad

[bernard]

Emad,

The Pen is mighter than the Sword

It means that "writing (words) are often stronger than war/gun."

Emad,

I agree about negotiate and the Art of Negotiation is easier when the negotiators are aware of the weakness and forces in presence.

The best way to win a war is knowing the enemy (learn him!).

But a war is uncessary since pain is not an enemy but a part of a normal response. We do not want to make a war to brains but want to learn these brains that peace is already there. :wink:

[nari]

emad

If you have a look at some of the many articles in this board, in the Persistent Pain section and in the journals listed in 'Journals Online', you will see that pain physiology is well researched and on a solid foundation.
The techniques used to manage persistent pain are still developing; but there are quite a few movements that can be used to alter the nociceptive effect of all thoses chemical messages pouring into the brain.

Even a massage. a light one, can help resolve the sharp edge of the pain while you plan for the patient's movement program.

Read as much as you can.


Nari

[emad]

HI Bernard & Nari :

Okay , like and agree on your views.

But , there is very strange point ,Since how long had been the human being existed on that planet ?? :arrow: very long thousands of years , and so since how long did the human being experince that pain ?? :arrow: So ashaming for human being to fail succefully with pain feel? Until Today??

Regards
Emad

[bernard]

Emad,

Human beings (as us) are existing since 5 million years and pain existed certainly before because it helps us to survive! Perhaps 500 or 800 millions years?

Man needs pain!!
Without pain man will die!

[emad]

Bernard :

Man needs pain!!
Without pain man will die!

No comment :!:

Emad

[bernard]

Emad,

It exists a very rare illness where nociceptors are not functionning and these patients have no chance to live after their 20'. Feeling pain engages body to avoid hurt and dangers.

[Anonymous]

Bernard :

I can not understand yr last post ??


Regards

Emad

[nari]

emad

I will leave Bernard to respond to your question, but I would like to say that without pain experience, we would not live long at all.

Injury happens to every one of us in some form; imagine what would happen with a very young child and a box of matches; someone with an infection; someone with severe stomach pain; someone with appendicitis.

It is essential for survival. But sometimes, the brain gets into a loop and keeps on producing unnecessary pain, such as someone with 20 years of disabling back pain which has no strong anatomical reason for that pain persistence. Our job is to assist that person (ie the brain) to change its interpretation of incoming chemical messages.


Nari

[bernard]

Emad,

Nari replied very well.
There is some genetic disease where patients do not feel any pain when they hurt themselves by burn or whatever you want. They die before the age of 20 because of sur-infection or traumas.

[emad]

Hi Bernard & Nari :

yes, I agree with you both about pain necessaity to prevent more damage , may be it is a protective self-mechanism of the Boday , I think the idea that pain is pleasant and harmful thing at the same time is very old and correct idea in the view pain researchers , books, writers .

However the above idea you are trying to explain is not our different (Difference)point , Okay may be I misused the word of pain , let me say it the suffering of the man , more specifically through our speciality , that back pain ..... Let us call it what ever pain ..suffering ...uncomfortable feeling ......discomfort .....complain ........No problem the names , our main point is since when the man complains , It is the truth s/he suffering that problem since centurties , but no true progress , no real approach .However , no doubt that expereince is an important element in approaching /dealing with any thing , and i do not doubt the man neglect that issue , on the other hand he dealth with that issue , but Great failer ......yes , mishandled the issue sometimes , his interefernce complicated the issue ............


Regards
Emad

[bernard]

Emad,

Just true!

Pain is our friend when it is necessary.
Pain is a hell when we do not understand its necessity!

[emad]

Hi Bernard :

I agree with your foreview , without pain man would had disapperaed,u r right .

Regards

Emad